16:14 FL: use mkt hours to follow your setups no guessing...after hours review and evaluate....find a
simple setup and try and follow it with flawless execution.

16:14 FL: you will get what you realy want out of trading.....talk to yourself and decide what you want and do what you know is right....

16:23 FL: rick define your setup in writting and keep an exact record of how it performs the next 2
weeks...if you see it did well wether you took it or not you will know if it is good and help build your
confidence in that wetup and will make it easier to do in the future

16:23 FL: you must believe in yourself and your plann....keep good records and your confidence will

16:23 FL: I have posted my simple scalp setups many times ....buy the first pullback in an upwave in an

16:23 FL: my position requires a higher high and a higher low on a wave chart that is over simplified ....

16:23 FL: the disipline comes by believing and clearing your mind to focus on what your research has shown to work.

16:28 FL: this business is you against yourself.....you must learn that and believe it and work on it...

08:48 FL: stop thinking and define your setups and wait for them then take action....define in writing

08:48 FL: the day should be for reacting and working on execution you can tghink all you want at night when you do your research...just my opinion

08:48 FL: define and use the setups you like dont think during the day

08:00 FL: 7

08:00 FL: stop 3 points on a 3 min es from entry .....target zone .75 to 3

08:00 FL: I like to take the first window of opportunity...

08:00 FL: I also like to use the waves that coordinate with the trend

08:00 FL: but allways exceptions...pick the waves u like and pass on the ones u dont like

08:00 FL: I mostly use min charts and a 266 on the es...i

08:00 FL: each time frame is a mkt by itself IMO

08:00 FL: for scalping my stop is 3 points from entry absolute no fudging....my target is min ,75 max 3 points.....if target is more it is not in my scalping book...when I go for a bigger tgt that is a swing or position trade and must be entered at the start of a trend or after a nice corretion

08:00 FL: waves make up the trend

08:00 FL: different wave formations tell me the possibility of a start of a trend or the place to position for a swing trade after a nice correction.....scalping is a game by itself

08:00 FL: before I enter a trade I know wether it is a scalp or position and target accordingly

08:00 FL: I use elliot as one of my guids but no strict interpatation

08:00 FL: many different ways to win just test and believe your setups....then do them...
08:00 FL: and risk control
08:00 FL: as I say I like the first one (window of opp)

08:00 FL: if in downwave for a scalp I place offers above the ma

08:00 FL: if this was in an upwave yes but I like the first window

08:00 FL: yes V flip

business is RISK CONTROL...

FL: gentlemen: just a thought, prior to entering a trade a decision should have been made is this a
scalp or a position trade....ask yourself based on the current market would you want to take a position trade long or short ...you should have some criteria that tells you if a position trade is warented if yes use your sto work to enter if not wait (patience) untill your work or indicator tells you a position trade is warented....... if a position is taken place your stop and have faith in your work untill you reach your target or a danger signal is flashed........position trades should be looking for 10 handels plus and they dont occur more than a few times a week.....IMO....as allways a risk control program should be in place..........scalping is a different game ...just a thought good trading.....have an overall plan....

FL: you should have a plan that meet your criteria...i do 2 things positions ....my 3 min trend has been down for a while since it broke the 95 area that would have been a good area for a position short...(look at your own work if our time frames are similar the trend should be similar....the trend is still down so you can cover your short or wait for a real danger signal...as far as a position long I need a bottom formation to develope than a long can be taken...it is allways nice to enter positions at the start of a trend.....scalping should be based on a plan also and can be done anytime 5 t0 15 times a day depending on your targets...

FL: if you want consistency you should use min charts tick charts are misleading

FL: and you can have 49 ticks of 1 lot for a bar or 49 tickts of 100 lots for a bar...you lose the real feel for the movement and volume in my opinion..

FL: price action is higher highs lower lows ABC formations and than within those areas you will find
minor support and resistance.

FL: I think you should pick the main time frame and the same indicators that would hold down the

FL: a sugestion I listen and stay confused it would be nice to hear the following.. the mkt is moving up or in an upwave and we are looking to find a short when we see an indication of top .now agree on the formations needed. than place a stop and either set atarget or find the reason to cover ..if you all could get to gether it will help

FL: I believe that an opportunity for a trade occurs after a wave change. red is price (pasavento
patterns) .Oranange is a volitility line I consider taking a trade when the first pullback occurs in an
upwave , or the first retracement occurs in a downwave , as designated by the cicles.

FL: we now croosed into an up wave I would consider taking a buy on the next pullback below the
green ma 7 period ..

FL: now I do look at the big picture and pick and choose the waves I play anf pass. I will post a more complete chart to show the wave progres.

FL: but if the choice is to play I wait for the pullback and use a maximum 3 point stop.and target as I like.

FL: what this does for me is to allow me to have fewer decision places and to know what trade type I am looking for. again I do pick the waves to play based on wave patterns and the overall trend.

FL: buy or sell windows

FL: that is the action area I do pick and choose the ones to play based on the wave patterns and the trend...if you take them all for scalps 1.5 points that will work..so far today all trades achieved a 1.5 min possible target ....sto I use is 3 points

FL: sto =stop

FL: win some lose some wait for the next one

FL: its august the mkt does not do to much....

FL: that is why you need your rules totaly formated ...so you dont think to much during the day...when a set up occurs just decide to play or not ...if yes follow your rules work on execution....i still hear you gentleman trying to agree if a setup actually occured. I know it is dificult because you have a lot of indicators to match up....

FL: I like to trade with the trend..i find it easier and less confusing

FL: and generaly more rewarding

FL: what I find is that if you pick an area to act it makes the whole process simpler.

FL: that area is a simple formula

FL: my formula is the circles

FL: I am not saying that mines is the best it just makes trading easy when you have an action area
predetermined ...if you miss it wait for the next area.......use some filters to help you pick the waves to play.....look to your long term sto for help....

FL: all I am saying is that trading is easy when you can predetermine an exact area to take action ..if action is planed to be taken...

FL: orange is a volitility stop 9,2.5 not critical....the red is nothing more than the pasavento patterns it is nearter than price bars...

FL: for me it makes trading opportunities easy to see.....the concept is important not the spesific values of the ma or vline

FL: for this type of trading I only take action in the circles with a bid or offer.if you are scalping put your order for target in ..no more than a 3 pt stop and you can move it closer if you like......

FL: this way you are never chasing a mkt

FL: as Bernard Baruch use to say he allways bot to late and sold to soon all he got was the middle third of a move ...that is what I try to do........i put a bid in on a scale basis starting .5 below avg ....not critical

FL: this style will never have you enter at the bootom for a long or top for a short..... but you could get lucky when you cover ..... dont expect to win all trades......

FL: you should use some way of picking and passing on the waves

FL: formations patterns trends elliot ....sto momentum what ever it will help....the obvious is when the mkt is in a good uptrend dont play the down waves....

FL: if this low holds will look to take the next buy opp if not I wont... need a failswing to the
upside......we made LL and LH

FL: the trades that I like is the first HL after a nice down move or a LH after a nice up move ...or ABC

FL: my system does not turn up or down it just points out windows of trade opportunities.....you must determine if you want to play or pass onthe wave....choose however you like .....

FL: when I traded on the floor we allways tried to gun for the stops

FL: first you have a lot of in and out traders they offset themselves

FL: second you have the big positions coming in and staying and taking the contracts out of play they make the mkt move..so you have to watch the big positions

FL: it is simple not confusing no indicators ...just choose the waves to play and the waves to pass... the last blue circle came off of a HL-HH..formation ...i like that

FL: first I decide before a wave starts am I going to play or pass.If play I put bids in under the ma as
soon as the V line changes.with an occasional adjustment..

FL: but the circles are the only area of entry for me

FL: I look at a 15 min to help with the trend ...and to help determine the targets..

FL: if 15 is in a downwTREND and an up WAVE I look for a position trade from the short side minimum 14 point target....

FL: if the 15 min in a down TREND and downWAVE I SCALP from the short side

FL: if the 15 min in a downTREND and down WAVE and I get a HH _HL I will take a long trade

FL: and sometimes I just take any circle window that I want.


FL: remember you have a trend and waves within the trend

FL: all I have is an area of opportunity I dont know what the mkt will do

FL: that is not a pasavento on the 15 min.it is a program on espl that plots the extreame points of the waves

FL: position trading is simple just wait for a rally in a downtrend and find a reason or formation to go
short..in an uptrend wait for a pullback and than a reason for a buy or a formation you like...RISK

FL: scalping is a different game...short term trading is also a different game..many ways to skin a cat decide on the one or ones you like set a goal and DO IT and KISS

FL: I am old fasioned and I still keep my charts by hand..

FL: the reason as I said before the mkt goes up .is that some one or unrelated group is buying and
holding onto the contracts they bought ...they are taking them out of play this can be seen by the
movement in the open interest maybe....the day traders dont sustain a move.

FL: I sold my last third into this rally flat

FL: I do not pay attention to new highs or lows to confusing all I have are my windows of opportunity...

FL: people think the mkts move with some kind of mystical order...BS...or secret code...BS...and if you could only learn this code....THE MKT is mostly random witha trend bias...learn to harness this trend component

FL: I have been profitable for many many years I cant pick tops or bottoms..but I can get a piece out of the middle

FL: the orange is a volitility 9 ,2.5....the ma is a 7 ...not criticle the red is price pasavento pattern

FL: dont try to project just try and get on board the current wave ...for scalping get the middle for a
position stay with it...but use other things to determine the waves to play and pass

FL: the wave is simple movement above or below the v line that determines the start and the end

FL: crossing the v line starts and end the wave

FL: use any time frame any v line ....it is the concept that is important ...the only magic is in the risk controll numbers

FL: my only choice is to get in at the begining of a wave or I pass...the circle

FL: I watch all the formations HH HL ABC elliot A higher time frame ..and then I pick the waves to play and to pass

FL: stop never more than 3 points...i only enter on bids or offers

FL: I use no indicators ...except for the v line and ma

FL: I play the swing chart I have been keeping it buy hand since the early 60s

FL: the only magic is RISK CONTROL

FL: the absolutes are the action window...the circle.........and the stop.......targets are open

FL: below my entry price

FL: that is my risk period

FL: my short term trading is 77% wins 1.2:1 risk reward that is going back thousands of real trades.

FL: my positions are around 57% and 3,7 :1

FL: I do trade against my position from time to time...

FL: but as old turkey said I cant afford to lose my position and thank you for the warning

FL: just remember 2 types of trading positios ,,,,and short term or scalps ...know what you are going to do before you do it...you can position or scalp or do both....your choice ..define your rules

FL: let me explain a little how I trade

FL: first I keep a a blotter for my long trades /positions that is a stand alone and does not know what my other 2 blotters are doind.........my second blotter is for the short trades /positions and that blotter does not know what blotter 1 or 3 is doing it is a stand a lone....so yes I could be long on blotter one with a stop ..and I also coud be short on blotter 2 with a stop.....now for blotter 3 that is only for scalps and that also does not know what blotter 1 or 2 is doing.........

FL: basicaly itrade in 3 demensions

FL: it sound confusing but is not

FL: but again I only einter in my windows or circles...

FL: in an uptrend sell signals are buy signals.....in a downtrend buy signals are sell signals.......

FL: I have been doing it for 40 years and have gotton to nice qty

FL: I have been profiled years ago in the wall st journal for controling the soy been mkt

FL: back in april of 1973

FL: just saw the mkt moving up and wanted to ring the cash register...

FL: A SUGGESTION; first I dont believe in a totaly automatic trading game.......but first determine an area where you would put on a long or a short.....and wait for it to show itself........seconed use a setup you like for entry and sotp......third manage your exit...the first area can be determined many ways formula, higher time frame, openings ,gut feel or anything you like. but have the patience to wait....as allways RISK CONTROL..

FL: and try to coordinate with the trend ....trades against the trend are ok but should be done after an extreme price move

FL: for example if you have determined that you are in a short area.....you are looking to sell short you can be a little less strict with your indicators..and get the trade on...with a stop ...if that is wrong try a gain ....with small stops...but when you are right have the guts to stay with it for a ride!!!!!!!

FL: gentlemen do youselves a favor ......you alll seem to be looking for success..probably been looking for a long time...why dont you take a few minutes and define it ..once you define it you can design a methodology to achieve it... and be able to trade with a real full plan......

FL: I put together a business plan helper of sorts if you would like a copy pse email me I have sent out over 65 so far.......no cost no charge no guarantees....mbr4343@hotmail.com......have I sent it to any of you gentlemen as yet if so gas it helped?

FL: my first mentor worked with livermore

FL: my mentor worked with him and was one of his brokers

FL: he kept saying buy signals are sell sig in a downtrend ...and sell sig are buy sig in an uptrend.....it is very true

FL: barry lind was my floor broker in the 60s.....lind waldock.....

FL: richard dennis was my grain broker...on the floor

FL: Gann died broke so the story goes

FL: I ran an office for bernie maduff in the 70s

FL: when his son Mike took over it went bad

FL: I have wyckoff original coarse on my desk now...it sold for $1,500 in the 30s it is excelent

FL: yes in 1940

FL: in the sherry netherland hotel

FL: livermore wrote a book himself...how to trade in stocks......the livermore formula for combining time element and price...it is good

FL: this business is very easy if you have risk controll ,,and repeatable and consistant setups, and
learn when to use them and guess what they wont give you a winner every time that is ok...i had a loss this week on a trade or 2 but had a nice week...

FL: A SUGGESTION; first I dont believe in a totaly automatic trading game.......but first determine an area where you would put on a long or a short.....and wait for it to show itself........seconed use a setup you like for entry and sotp......third manage your exit...the first area can be determined many ways formula, higher time frame, openings ,gut feel or anything you like. but have the patience to wait....as allways RISK CONTROL..

FL: and try to coordinate with the trend ....trades against the trend are ok but should be done after an extreme price move

FL: for example if you have determined that you are in a short area.....you are looking to sell short you can be a little less strict with your indicators..and get the trade on...with a stop ...if that is wrong try a gain ....with small stops...but when you are right have the guts to stay with it for a ride!!!!!!!

FL: I have been trading for over forty years and very very very successfuly and I am allways interested in learning...and I have found some value in the sto stuff but it appears to be an artful application nothing that is an absolute.and I like to hear valid explanations ..and from time to time I try and contribute from my knowledge...

FL: in my opinion you gentleman are trying hard and I hear the frustration from time to time. I am not saying that this stuff is not of value ...but I do not hear you addresing the big picture of trading for profit..and without an overall plan combined with risk controll you are going to find success very
difficult.....have a goal have a plan to define an area of opportunity than apply your sto work to help you enter and exit..and have the patience to wait ....for the right time to trade...trading is a business treat it as such ....

FL: by the way the s&p is one of the hardest mkts to trade .you might consider looking to more
mkts..you will find it easier...but the e mini is the most liquid for day trading..

FL: look at the consumables they move based on real supply and demand not just emotions...

FL: I like to sell into strength and wanted to ring the cash register

08:53 FL: with all do respect to you gentleman ...what I believe is the following ...first use some way of Identifying an area of opportunity ..for example a corection in an uptrend giving you a so called buy opportunity.... now you can use the sto or the erg to help you pull the long trigger...that is the best I have found.. and I will use it as a guide from time to time...

11:22 FL: it will show itself when it happens,,,patience

11:28 FL: if you want the next window you follow it ,,,backtest ,,believe ...and you find the way to
choose the waves to play or pass just be consistant...and most important risk controll....

15:05 FL: nothing is ever for sure that is why it is called speculating..
12:31 FL: you shpuld diversify for swing trades in other mkts ...imo

12:32 FL: they work a little better but noliquidity like the S&P

12:37 FL: my attidude is that the mkt is never to high to buy or to low to sell.....all I need is a viable
nearby stop loss

12:38 FL: price is meaningless to me ..my key is how far away my stop is

12:39 FL: whatever works for you is what you should do...just be consistant ...and allways risk control

12:44 FL: I dont believe in cycles or indicators just price patterns or formations...it is easy for me that wy less confusing....but many ways to skin a cat do what is comfortable and statistacly positive for you....

12:46 FL: as long as you can quantify your methodolgy and repeat it..and it has a positive expectation .....and you use risk controll you will be ok

12:49 FL: that is true I miss some also... but I find that if you dont try and think about the setup during trading..just react you will be better off in the long run.....

12:51 FL: do your thinking testingetc after hours and work on flawless execution during the trading

12:54 FL: I believe in waiting for my window of opportunity....enter...place stop...and use a creative exit stratagy....based on the big picture...

13:15 FL: programing is good for backtesting if it works use it as a guide

13:21 FL: they can work but if the program is short term ...a minor difference in the fills is critical...

13:24 FL: if you can explain it with absolutly no discretion or if ...and ..or buts..it can be
programed.....BUT CAN YOU GET THE FILLS... especialy when you use quantity...???

13:36 FL: one of the best edges you can have for short term or scaping is to sell on offers and buy on the bids..the majority of my trades are entered and exited on resting orders..

08:08 FL: and try and stay with your positons a little longer ..

08:08 FL: rick take ownership and make the stuff yours own it ..

08:45 FL: THE holy grail is risk control than trade with the trend

10:29 FL: I know it is not my business , but I have been listening on ventrillo the past days and I hear s much questioning and thinking....i mo the key to making money is to have your setups predefind and when they show do them dont keep guessing...i mean no offense just an observation...and try and go with the flow of the mkt

09:46 FL: stop thinking and define your setups and wait for them then take action....define in writing

09:48 FL: the day should be for reacting and working on execution you can tghink all you want at night when you do your research...just my opinion

10:00 FL: define and use the setups you like dont think during the day

10:04 FL: it sounds like some of you drive yourself nutty during the day ....define and wait for YOUR
setups....and dont forget the trend

10:45 FL: when in an uptrend wait for a pullback a real one than u have a window of opportunity now
use your setups to get on board...bye for now I did well leaving for a while...

10:47 FL: define your own ....but realy define it and have patience

15:10 FL: keep your setups simple ...identify a window of opportunity....have a trigger... have a
stop...target can be open or a predtermined price.....

15:33 FL: I try to position trade mostly ..i scalp for entertainment and to keep myself busy so I dont
messup my positions.......or swing trade a few days to a few weeks at a time

15:33 FL: I try to get in at the start of a trend if I have the proper setup...

15:37 FL: if you treat trading as a business remove the emotions the sky is the limit...

15:37 FL: what I think most people are missing is a true commitment to themselves to do it propurly....

15:37 FL: my setups are far from magic....my magic is in following my rules ...and a comprehensive risk cotrol plan....

15:40 FL: they dont 70% winners...means 30% losers...part of the business.

15:43 FL: I have said this before ...SET A GOAL...HAVE A METHOD OR GAME PLAN......HAVE A

testing them.......

15:43 FL: and use them properly...

15:48 FL: first you must make a real commitment to yourself that you will define YOUR rules and will folow them...

15:48 FL: when I was at M.I.T......we proved beyound a doubt that the magic is in risk control....

08:48 FL: if you want to win big and consistantly ....make the commitment to yourself to treat this as a highly organized and disiplined business.....

08:48 FL: the rewards or profit can be amazing as you build on a strong foundation....

08:48 FL: the game plan is easy ....following it is the hard part....you must be commited to do it the right way following your rules.......

09:03 FL: I have posted my simple scalp setups many times ....buy the first pullback in an upwave in an uptrend....

09:03 FL: my position requires a higher high and a higher low on a wave chart that is over simplified ....

09:03 FL: the disipline comes by believing and clearing your mind to focus on what your research has sown to work.

09:03 FL: this business is you against yourself.....you must learn that and believe it and work on it...

09:03 FL: those of you who will take the time to put your setups in writing ..and have a talk with yourself as t decide what you want out of trading....i will be happy to give you my number next week and will try and help.....but you must write up your setups and realy be commited...

09:03 FL: the passavento patterns...min size 0....min bars 2....just shows swing highs and lows

09:03 FL: I also like to use the waves that coordinate with the trend

09:03 FL: but allways exceptions...pick the waves u like and pass on the ones u dont like

12:59 FL: for scalping yes

13:00 FL: if in downwave for a scalp I place offers above the ma

13:01 FL: if this was in an upwave yes but I like the first window


13:08 FL: my setup must setup my way...for a scalp

13:10 FL: by keeping my swings by hand and looking for different formations I like....the trend..an elliot count time of day...higher time frame...etc.etc.

10:53 FL: for me I seperate position trades from scalping trades

11:36 FL: I treat each time frame as a seperate mkt for scalping

11:39 FL: combining time frames for scalping is to confusing for me.......positioning a different story

07:43 FL: one min smaller stops smaller tgts for scalping

07:43 FL: when u get some confidence and use qty the money adds up nicely

09:54 FL: the only 2 absolutes are wait for trigger...and your stop cant be increased...otherwise be

09:55 FL: just know in advance wether you are a scalper or a positioner

09:59 FL: I trade 3 ways long positioner short positioner and scalper...they each play thier own game

10:03 FL: since the mid 990s my long trader has done very well..my short positioner had 1 small loss and a break even...scalper stands alone and does his thing

10:05 FL: I call this trading in 3 dimentions

11:15 FL: I stay in most of the time

11:17 FL: you can do what you want except you cant violate the stop

11:19 FL: the closer the stop the lower the % winners but a better risk reward....the smaller the target the higher the % winners but a lower risk reward...its all in the math ...just make sure you have a positive expectation..

11:25 FL: trading is basicaly mathmatics and probabilities...learn to think in math and not in what u
think about the mkt

11:27 FL: a nice setup gives u the edge ...its like owning the casino

15:38 FL: charts need price volume and time to show in the bars ...tick charts are to bland they are not time or volume sensitive therefor misleading and they dont give you the right picture of the real
action..but to each his own

16:00 FL: the only thing of value for a form of projection is trend...a body in motion tends to stay in
motion etc.

16:00 FL: untill it decides not to

16:08 FL: study and research and good setups properly executed will give you the edge...thats it. ...and money mng...

16:28 FL: for scalping only enter on a bid or offer

16:28 FL: its a big edge

6:33 FL: a few hundred will run the mkt when every body is buying on a minor breakout..that is were I try and sell to them

16:50 FL: also have a way to play and pass on your waves

17:37 FL: brach that is all there is to it put offers above the ma for shorts bids below ma for longs

08:11 FL: no I watch no pivot points at all

08:11 FL: just waves some for scalping some for positions when it coordinates with a higher time frame

08:11 FL: for positions just pick a high and low time frame and diversify into a bunch of mkts....use risk cntrol. test and believe and you will do very very well...

08:11 FL: the styrength in having a plan is you only have to act when the mkt followes your
setups....you do not have to act all the time


08:58 FL: the key is tio use a 3 pt stop and to buy a dip in an upwave or sell a rally in a down
wave....tgt what you like..

08:58 FL: also you should choose the waves to play or pass

08:58 FL: its a guide only just put in bids under the mkt after a down bar.....just a guide

08:58 FL: no you wont buy the low of the bar you might do better or worse but by buying on bid only it will work....the 3 pt stop is the important part

08:58 FL: if you like scalping this is an easy way to do it ....study and think about it....the first
opportunity in the wave is the most important, then just get in phase..

10:54 FL: I do nt know what the mkt will do but is it part of your plan to take down waves in an

10:54 FL: picking them is easy playing them properly is the real question....

:54 FL: without a complete plan you have nothing and are doomed

11:12 FL: a body in motion tends to stay in motion (direction) unless it decides to change ....the trend is yor edge

11:12 FL: you most choose the ones to play or pass based on your plan...understand your
targeting....this is a down wave in an uptrend

11:13 FL: the picking or passing has a lot to do with your goals..

11:16 FL: the most money will be made by taking all the waves. however in an uptrend the up waves will make good profits and the down waves will make a little or break even that is ok...the opposite will occur in a down wave ...also in a choppy mkt both will make money but on a more equall bassis


11:27 FL: MY POSITION PLAYER WAS ABLE TO DO THE FOLLOWING...GET LONG IN mid 1120 area , sell out around 1138, because stop was to far away....yesterdays power buy allowed for reentry with a much closer stop.....and with the strong rally now profits can be taken........trade
management....what it will do now I dont know...but stop far away again...and rhe mkt has been in an uptrend ...the buy window of opportunity on the daily worked well....remember it does not allways work....the trend is your edge..

11:28 FL: you must have a plan of action

11:30 FL: but I still have faith no matter how many times I show these actions very few will listen and even less will do it...but I still wish you luck...

11:31 FL: it is not you against the mkt it is you against yourself...

07:39 FL: brach that is all there is to it put offers above the ma for shorts bids below ma for longs

11:06 FL: if you have found this setup ineresting do some hand drawn wave charts and you will find
formation to pass on the wave others to play and some to go for a keeper or a big winner study you will find them...

13:12 FL: not realy just want people to be careful and not get frustrated when it has a few losses ..and it will...if you study the swing chart it will help you pick the waves to play or pass

13:14 FL: I keep wave charts by hand on a lot of mkts

13:14 FL: helps me see what is going on

10:16 FL: this is a classic octagon formation

14:48 FL: I make my trends easy to start and more difficult to end..that will allow me to have both an up and down trend at the turning points ...and yes sometimes my long trader is long and my short trader is short ..as the trend progresses I increase my qty....the scalper does his own thing...

08:12 FL: I am never bullish or bearish as long as the uptrend is still up based on my method I am
happy to put my position back on with a close stop

08:12 FL: patience is a key

08:46 FL: I dont use or believe in indicators just price action and waves that is all I use

08:46 FL: the more time frames and indicators you use the easier it is to talk yourself out of a trade....

08:06 FL: when I enter I do not look for support or resistance I just use a measured amount

08:06 FL: for my stop

16:59 FL: I only took the buys because the 3 min chart was in an uptrend......in an uptrend or possible bottom take the upwaves....in a downtrend or a possible top take the downwaves.......

07:50 FL: position trades only occur 2 or 3 times aweek

07:50 FL: scalps all day long

07:50 FL: for get scalps for a min

07:50 FL: when I put on a position my stop is generaly 3 pts...

07:50 FL: for a position I want the possible start of a move...

07:50 FL: my stop is just 3 points from my entry

11:05 FL: pick the waves anyway that you like some for scalps some for positions your choice ...wait for the window of opportunity use a stop and let it go for what you want..

11:06 FL: any sensible consistant way of picking the waves to play should work...the risk control is key

11:08 FL: dont get stuburn or to compicated

11:09 FL: I use elliot as a guide higher time frame as a guide and trend as a guide...to help me pick the waves to play or pass...

11:15 FL: if in a downtrend to an uptrend.....an absolute trend change requires a higher high than a a HL than a penitration of the HH,,,a possible trend change only a higher low with the help of elliot or a higher time frame...a penitration of a previous low by a small amount is ok of the previous low to count as a HH...or find a consistant way you like...will go into more detail if you care to call.

11:18 FL: dont expect all the trades to work this is a business of probabilities....

11:24 FL: my trend determination is far from perfect keep the wave charts by hand and make up any sensible way of trend determination you like ....it is obvious that HH and HL repeating is an uptrend .....i have said this before...KEEP YOUR WAVE CHARTS BY HAND AND YOU WILL LEARN TO IDENTIFY TRENDS....i make my trend easy t start and harder to end...at the turning points I can have both an up and down trend at the same time...a trend has a begining a middle an an end...just learn to identify the possible begining for posdition trades....

11:28 FL: nothing is an absolute this is abusiness of PROBABILITIES AND MATH...

12:04 FL: rick print out some of the charts and play with themm...a positive trend change for me
is.......from down to upis ....1 HH...HL...than a pen of the HH.....i will make a chart for you..give me a min...

12:19 FL: that was a simple fail swing to the upside after a 5 wave down (elliot)

09:02 FL: pick the waves anyway that you like some for scalps some for positions your choice ...wait for the window of opportunity use a stop and let it go for what you want..

11:14 FL: the reason is that the public is mostly on the long side and when they get out they tend to exasterbate the mkt...

15:09 FL: the general answer to trends are as follows. the consumables trend better real supply
demand.....most mkts will have a real nice move every 3 to 5 years...and a real big move every 10 to 15 years. and a mania move every 30 to 50 years...but the excanges will drop margins as a mkt losses volitility and raise margin as the mkt gains volitility.....so a small trend may yield a better return on dollars invested if the margin is low also the stops or risk will be less.

15:17 FL: that is why I use the volitility stop on my work it is robust to the current volitility

15:17 FL: self adjusting

:03 FL: rick every the mkt moves up you seem to be looking for a top...why dont you just follow the

13:15 FL: I allways use the same settings not magic just consistant

13:17 FL: 9 ,2.5

13:17 FL: everything all mkts

13:17 FL: its just a guide you have to use somthing...

13:22 FL: for what ever reason most people try to find tops in an uptrend as opposed to wait for dips to buy ......

13:24 FL: and yes you will find the top if you keep trying but imo you miss to much good stuff and
generaly people wont stay with the short long enough if they truely got the top...

13:35 FL: gentlemen I have said this many times to win consistently in the mkt you need a plan with easy absolute setups , a money mng plan and a belief in your work....

10:22 FL: when you follow set ups automatically that is a no brainer...when you think during the day
you use your brain...your choice

10:36 FL: I dont think I play poker on line most of the time when a setup occurs I just do it...

10:36 FL: thinking and study develops your setups.....reacting to them should be automatic...

12:36 FL: the further away the stop the higher the probability of a winner

12:41 FL: trading done properly is boring.

12:41 FL: but profitable

11:50 FL: its just a 15 min swing chart..based on a volitility stop ...9,2.5

11:54 FL: yes but the trick is to find a chart that you are comfortable and base your trading on that
chart..dont try to find a chart to fit your opinion.....have a chart that gives you signals...

12:46 FL: when determining the trend you MUST relate it to a time frame

10:06 FL: no indicator can be 100% consistant you and your risk control must and can be 100%

12:28 FL: the v line is nothing more than a robost trend line.

12:52 FL: what ever you use keep it simple and the trend is a good guide . when you get in at a
possible begining hang in

13:33 FL: use what you are comfortable with it does not matter just be consistent..the 3 min is my
primary action time frame

13:34 FL: use what is comfortable for you...

13:35 FL: I need a window of opportunity on a higher time frame than I use the 3 min to find the setup that coordinates

13:37 FL: and once you get a position on learn to manage it

13:40 FL: dont ever be afraid to be wrong !!!!!!! it will happen . I even had a loser in the last year or so.

13:45 FL: trading is nothing more than math and probabilities . but you must have a consistant plan of action to make it work'

13:52 FL: here is a clue use it if you like....1. design a method to only trade the long side only test it and prove it......2. design a plan to trade the short side only test it and prove it...NOW USE THEM BOTH WITHOUT ANY CONSIDERATION AS TO WHAT THE OTHER IS DOING...

13:58 FL: think about it if you have a nice upmove the long side should make a big profit and the short side should lose a little .but you wont have to guess just follow rules and setups and manage your positions

13:59 FL: in a down move the short makes the money . in a range they both make a little

15:01 FL: keep the waves by hand take5 it will start to tell the story of the mkt once you get use to it.

15:03 FL: I work about 2 hours a night to find the plays for the next day

10:29 FL: the only conpetition you should have in trading is with yourself and your ability to execute as flawlessly as possible

10:48 FL: 1. waves to play for SCALPING...... first use some method to determine the trend just stay consistent . trade the waves in the direction of the trend use elliot as a guide. remember that a trend has a begining a middle and an end we only can know the possible beginning when it is happening, the middle and end we know after the fact. going counter to the trend wait for at least a failure swing....or after a so called grand rush climax .....i use an approximate 3 pt stop ..the nature of scalping is to go for small targets only 1 to 3 points. draw your swing charts by hand it helps . if the mkt has had a few upswings in a row I stop playing them.on a 3 min chart you will get 20 25 waves a week I play only 10 to 15 of them......i like to take the first window in a wave but you can take others also...

10:58 FL: waves to play for POSITIONS. I use a higher time frame 15 min 60 min daily. whatever you like again pick one and stay consistant...if a buy window of the higher time frame occurs you should be looking only to buy . a failswing is a nice indication of a possible restart up a HH HL is also a nice indication or some kind of elliot count is a nice GUIDE ONLY. the position trade must occur in a higher time frame window of opportunity.. the % winners will be less than the scalps but the risk reward much better. these trades should occur at the beginning of a new leg up...stay consitant now manage the trade and it is good to pyramid sometimes. I also trade against the position trade

11:29 FL: from time to time I trade almost everything..no true range I only use wave charts to me it is the absolute lowest common denominator of real mkt action...

11:30 FL: the v line numbers are not magic use what you like BE CONSISTENT...THE MAJIC IS IN



12:01 FL: I keep a 15 to 60 min swing chart on most mkts very very helpful....for me


15:11 FL: no...when you make a profit it builds your confidence to continue to follow rules and

06:55 FL: when you learn to do this it is like getting paid upfront to trade....

06:55 FL: you can determine trend lets say up....1./ wait for good dip sell puts ....2. sell calls and only trade the long side...if you are wrong on the long side you will make it up by the deteriation of the calls ...but be careful it is like having a tiger by the tail when the mkt moves....but again I am only a seller.....buying is another game

never buy options only sell....i also write against my future positions....you must be careful and can bite you and you should keep a good cash reserve ....it is not as easy as it seems

07:59 FL: I was an option specialist and market maker on the amex years ago

07:59 FL: when you enter the option it is very important to do so on bid or offer the spread can kill

07:59 FL: I sell both sides but I would strongly recomend ONE SIDE ONLY untill you are an expert..

07:59 FL: and use the daily chart for the trend no short term charts....

07:59 FL: min or tick

07:59 FL: when you learn to do this it is like getting paid upfront to trade....

07:59 FL: you can determine trend lets say up....1./ wait for good dip sell puts ....2. sell calls and only trade the long side...if you are wrong on the long side you will make it up by the deteriation of the calls ...but be careful it is like having a tiger by the tail when the mkt moves....but again I am only a seller.....buying is another game

07:05 FL: I like to wait for daily to go into buy zone and act on a lower time frame for entry and
stop...can follow more mkts that way

07:05 FL: I can pyramid and campaign better by looking at the big picture...and getting in in phase with main trend

07:05 FL: simple trend following and patience

16:16 FL: thats it same as scalp rules except you can keep taking windows of opportunity

16:19 FL: I think this is the simplest and least confusing way of trading and allows campaigning....

17:17 FL: I go to a lower time frame for entry and stop once in the daily buy zone window

17:17 FL: and then pyramid as it starts to work

17:19 FL: I start with one unit and add more units when I get additional signals and raise stop on all

17:20 FL: once I start adding I am break even if stoped out

17:20 FL: at worst

17:24 FL: wait for a valid buy wave on low time frame

17:24 FL: and add

17:25 FL: more like days but I will get out into good strength and then when I buy back I can add qty

17:27 FL: I sold out into late rally yesterday and just bought back into the early weekness today....

17:28 FL: once you get into phase with mkt it is simple

17:28 FL: but remember I trade both the long and short at the same time upon occasion

17:29 FL: I think position or swing trading is a lot easier than scalping

17:30 FL: and you can trade more mkts at the same time

17:32 FL: keep things simple and remember the edge is in the trend of the mkt

17:33 FL: and you must have PATIENCE & RISK CONTROL....


17:37 FL: REMEMBER NOTHING IS 100% ....



17:40 FL: if the mkt is boiling give it to them....at that point your stop is far away....

17:40 FL: you can get back in again and remember the price you reenter at is not important

17:41 FL: its the risk that counts

10:21 FL: for scalping on the 3 min you will get an avg of about 25 waves a week if you play 10 to 15 of them and average 1 pt per wave you will do very well......

10:22 FL: just waves some for scalping some for positions when it coordinates with a higher time frame

10:34 FL: for positions just pick a high and low time frame and diversify into a bunch of mkts....use risk control. test and believe and you will do very very well...

13:16 FL: the styrength in having a plan is you only have to act when the mkt followes your
setups....you do not have to act all the time


15:04 FL: when you believe and act with a good plan you can make all the money you want...

15:11 FL: I sell into strength and campaign my positions...

13:25 FL: if you like scalping this is an easy way to do it ....study and think about it....the first
opportunity in the wave is the most important, then just get in phase..

12:33 FL: there is no MAGIC FORMULA OR SECRET CODE ...just an edge with trend

14:50 FL: have YOUR reason to play or pass on a wave.

14:50 FL: yes I also use a lot of options...swing trades must occur in a window of opportunity on a high time frame



13:27 FL: in my opinion any body who trades counter to the main trend consistently, is a fool.

13:57 FL: by consistently trying to pick the top and missing the ride up is not very smart.....however if you have a good setup that tells top and you have the patience to wait for it to unfold properly that is ok, but you must be able to hold that position for a proper ride ...taking a small profit as a top picker is also not very smart in my opinion.....PLAN YOUR WORK AND WORK YOUR PLAN.....

15:31 FL: why take shorts in an uptrend? but if you do you can take the long also 2 seperate trades
....go with the trend is better unless you get at least a failure swing ....i took 3 longs today all good
offering my last trades at 06 now

12:34 FL: some questions you gentlemen should think about.....1 why are you trading...2 what do you want to achieve..3 how do you plan on achiving it (your methodology).. 4 what type of total risk plan will you use to let your methodology work....think about it and write down your total game plan....just a suggestion...

12:44 FL: trading is a business based on probabilities you must have enough money played properly to allow for losing trades staying power ....70% winners means 30% losers.....money mng

11:09 FL: if mkt has no big bids in and they know that there are a lot of stops around the locals would just sell a few to trigger them off..does not happen that ofton

11:10 FL: also a lot of traders will put stops a little higher than the low and it feeds on itself short term


11:06 FL: but I and my family do thank most of the counter trend traders.......i mean the main trend

11:19 FL: the trend, elliott as a guide, time of day, formations, some time gut feel based on other mkts ...but I wait for my setup.....as a scalper I dont care if I miss afew ......as a position trader I have a few more setups in the window of opportunity...

11:21 FL: as a scalper I try to take 10 to 15 base trades a week ...

11:27 FL: I dont pay attention to the reports...i trade with the trend and more often than not the mkt
moves with the prevailing trend....and yes I get cought some times

11:30 FL: but by not having a position going into a report I dont have any amunition to sell into an

13:01 FL: the longer term trend is up and extended, not the right place for me to take a major long
position and so far I dont have a short position setup.

13:34 FL: there is no magic to the numbers just stay consistant

13:41 FL: sometimes you will miss a trade and not make a profit,and somtimes you will take a trade and lose, when you keep changing your numbers it will all even out in the long run.......

13:43 FL: you must think in terms of a series of trades to determine your profitability....one trade does not make or break a system.....

13:44 FL: I dont buy low or sell high I try to get the middle piece...its easier

08:58 FL: what happens to counter trend traders?

08:58 FL: 1.the vast majority get thier head handed to them..

08:58 FL: 2. a fortunite few break even.

08:58 FL: 3.every now and then they get a good trade , but most wont have the guts to stay with the trade

11:26 FL: if one thing is making you 10 a day , keep doing it and add another method that can make additional money....

11:32 FL: do not use it but I worked with robert krauss in developing some of the ideas

11:33 FL: guess who showed it to robert. we were friends before he passed

11:35 FL: robert lived up the street from me

11:37 FL: just find a simple setup and keep using it , if it works

13:17 FL: its not you against the mkt....ITS YOU AGAINST YOURSELF...
13:20 FL: WHEN YOU HAVE A PLAN and follow your setups with proper risk control and belief in your work...it is fun and stress free.....its nothing more than playing a video game

15:59 FL: my long trader is up many many pts....the trend is your EDGE

16:03 FL: when the mkt turns into downtrend and if its a good trend the shortside trader will do very
well and the long trader will accomplish nothing

23:33 FL: my favorites are my so called abc or power trade or dot2 trades ....they are all the same just different names...

23:33 FL: well thank you just keep it simple....look at what I just posted.....remember 80% winners
means 20% losers part of the game

23:33 FL: good...this past month or so the s&p has been very easy ...when it gets choppy and it will dont get discouraged..when you have a nice trend going press it when choppy stay small

23:33 FL: remember your RISK CONTROLL IS THE MAGIC....


08:32 FL: I generaly pay no attention to closing positions at days end

08:32 FL: I dont pay attention to news

08:32 FL: no conflicts each mkt is a universe unto itself.....but use what you like as a guide to pick and pass waves



11:51 FL: IF you trade as a business you dont need anything else...

11:52 FL: I showed the abc or power trade the other day hope some of you followed...

12:25 FL: you have to watch and do the charts by hand you will be amazed at what you will find and

14:29 FL: in my opinion all that stuff is either coincedence or nonsense...and most of all a waste of
time. following a pre planed method that is easy to identify with risk control is the way to go....imo


11:05 FL: PERFECTION; consists not in doing extraordinary things, but in doing ordinary things
extraordinarily well.....

11:06 FL: the v line is not my stop

11:16 FL: YOUR GAME PLAN.......See first that the design is wise and complete; that ascertained,
persue it resolutely. Do not for one moment forego the purpose that you resolved to effect.....

14:45 FL: sorry win% for a 1 pt target is 81%....2 pt tgt is 67% ...3 pt tgt is 52%...the bigger the target the lower the percent winners...

14:47 FL: in order to take that trade it must be part of your plan....and this type of trade must be
managed carfully if you want more than 2 points...

15:01 FL: that is why I keep saying divise a complete trading and business plan with out it you are

15:27 FL: I like the volitility best but not critical..

15:30 FL: just remember the trend is your edge.....

15:34 FL: on my work if the last downwave would have gone below the low of the previous down wave low a power trade would have setup

15:44 FL: guys when you work up a complete plan in writing for your methods and setups you will not only see this stuff but know to play or pass,,,and just react..

16:03 FL: it just goes to the high and low of a wave ...i had a programer do it dont know the exact
workings but it does the proper thing and can change from volitility to parabolic with a simple input can also change the values

16:12 FL: my volitility is based on the close

16:12 FL: use the CLOSE ONLY

10:31 FL: OF THE LAST 9 POWER BUYS...6 yielded 20 or more pts 2 10 or more..1 loss of 3 pts....if these are in your arsenal of setups you dont think just react...all part of a master plan....and you should also have a plan for varying and or increasing volume .

10:32 FL: this is a power buy here now ...will it work I dont know, but over a series of them I do know they work very well.

10:57 FL: that is my break even point I want to give it as much room as possible ...i

10:58 FL: I would rather breakeven than take a small profit...and have the extra room..

11:00 FL: I do that because that is part of my normal plan

11:00 FL: for a power trade yes..

11:02 FL: my power trades make me big money or break even...

11:04 FL: the actual signal is just a small part of the game...

11:05 FL: dont think just react to your plan..

11:32 FL: just trading

11:34 FL: all auxiliary trades off of a base trade

11:37 FL: my point is once you put on a base trade you have many options ....but you must wait for that proper base trade to develope...patience

12:09 FL: forget the indicators just develope a plan...and keep the key points simple

12:19 FL: when you do this by hand it jumps out at you

14:20 FL: of the last 41 upwaves going for a 2 pt target 3 pt stop approximate 35 winners 6 losers..net

52..that is with a simple2 pt exit stratagy , with a litttle more planing and understanding and a
sophisticated exit stratagy profit many times greater than 52 points...study and you will see.....plan your work and work your plan...

14:27 FL: anyone who buys or sells for profit, employing a planed scientific method, coupled with
proper money managment is speculating in a professional manor. Without a complete plan you are just a GAMBLER........YOUR CHOICE...

15:10 FL: I have over 50 executions off of just 2 base trades that I took...first one did well second one not complete as yet

15:12 FL: when the vol fliped without taking out the prev high and than into the rally with a stop at

15:14 FL: yes but a full down trend was not inforce

15:16 FL: but you can make your own rules as to play or pass a wave when you do it by hand you will have a library to do your own research..with

15:17 FL: no courage just a plan

15:22 FL: so this trade even if I get stoped out will be a profit....a position for me can last many days or weeks

15:26 FL: once it is on I trade more with it and against it...my uptrend is still up this is a start of a
downtrend ...as I mentioned a while back I can have both an up and down trend at the same time
around the turning points..what will happen I dont know ...i had 2 prior false starts to downtrends since dec 10 or so

15:26 FL: I make my trends easy to start and harder to end

15:27 FL: design your own rules and just stay consistent

15:28 FL: I have not made any significant changes in over 20 years....in the book I wrote some 7 or 8 years ago shows the same rules..

15:33 FL: no when I put it out I charged $10,000 a copy and it was in the form of a trading course

15:35 FL: I sold 33 copies and only 3 people have truly succeded...it was very frustrating.....the big
problem is in people not having enough self controll and patience..

15:36 FL: trading methods are easy doing is the hard part.

15:37 FL: the commitment and desire and work ethic has to be not only overwelming but a true

15:40 FL: if you treat trading as a game enjoy have fun ...but to realy make it , it has to be a highly
desiplined business

15:41 FL: and if you cant truely control your emotions forget about it...

19:21 FL: I usually enter my stop before I even get fillied for safty

12:05 FL: my point is once you put on a base trade you have many options ....but you must wait for that proper base trade to develope...patience

12:05 FL: I use simple swing charts based on the volitility stop

11:05 FL: first I am supposed to have dinner with linda next week....i allways have a trend and I gear
my trading in the direction of the trend...i know this could sound confussing but from time to time I can have both an uptrend and down trend at the same time but not for very long...

11:06 FL: in the same time frame....i make it easy to start a trend and hard to end it ..

11:07 FL: so while still in an up a down can start ....

11:09 FL: if the mkt breaks the up will end and the down got a early start if we go up more the down will end and the up just continues...like now on a 3 min

11:10 FL: I show both up and down now on the 3 min

11:10 FL: so I trade both ways



09:32 FL: hope you all have a plan good trading

09:32 FL: just because the vol flips that does not me it is or is not a sell signal you need a plan to pass or play the wave...

09:32 FL: cooprdination is not required just stay consistent with what you have...

09:32 FL: its the consept

09:32 FL: the trick is to identify dot 1 possible trend start.....dot 2 power trades.....and the sequence of the failure swings 1 2 3 etc.

10:19 FL: each time frame is a mkt unto itself........i treat each time frame as a totaly seperate mkt

10:22 FL: the 60 min had a short window mon the daily had a long window yesterday....your plan
should tell you in advance what you are going to play....take one or take all just have a plan and follow it...if you do you will have some losses and some winners but in the long run you will do very well

10:26 FL: yes many games can be played at the same time . they are independent of each other....but in the long run they do complement...some times one is trading up and one down...and in a real move they will afree the majority of the time

10:31 FL: think FRACTALS

10:33 FL: YES WHEN IN A WINDOW ON A HIGH TIME frame I will use whatever I can to find an entry .......yes the white line is from the high of the wave to the low

12:40 FL: do what you want with the pass I like it sensitive I just use it to show minor swings around the mav

13:03 FL: seeing much, suffering much, and studying much, are the three pillars of learning.....

09:12 FL: if you are a scalper play the waves with the trend and just take a piece out of each wave
...thank you and wait for the next one

09:17 FL: you will get approximatly 25 waves a week , you should play 10 to 15 and average a point or less per wave will make you around 10 pts a week stay consistent and gradualy build your quantity

11:48 FL: dont think dont project dont draw crazy lines just follow a plan...

11:48 FL: and if you are a scalper SCALP



11:53 FL: I bid in .25 incraments , and will also take offers as it starts to turn sometimes.

11:55 FL: the targets are your choice ...but try and have offers above to get out

11:58 FL: I cover based on pure math...i dont pay much attention to support or resistance

11:59 FL: remember the mkt is basicaly random..the only edge you have is the trend

12:00 FL: you cant predict randomness so why bother

15:47 FL: you would be better to follow a number of mkts and wait for real position plays in my opinion

15:50 FL: you will have a hard time daytrading multiple mkts.you can lose your focus...best thing
increase qty in one mkt

15:52 FL: I have been doing this a long time and scalp only the s7P AND BONDS, AND POSITION

08:26 FL: the best thing I can advise dont think go with the flow . and I allways close out my scalps
alittle to soon just want a piece from the middle

08:26 FL: of the wave for scalping


08:26 FL: I HAVE not changed anything in years

08:26 FL: you will only think yourself out of trades

08:26 FL: try and get in at the beginning

11:36 FL: 1618 you have to set your own goals to start to determine the ones to pass or play what do you want to achieve..SET A GOAL DESIGN A PLAN TO ACHIEVE IT AND HAVE A MONEY
management...just have fun trading enjoy the action

11:49 FL: in order to even start choosing first are you a position trader ,are you a scalper, do you go for 1 2 or 3 points are you looking to continue to play within the wave..all these factors must be pre

11:50 FL: the numbers are all related to your tgts

11:51 FL: the bigger the tgt the lower the % winners but a better risk reward...

15:21 FL: I dont know what the mkt will do but is it part of your plan to take down waves in an

08:32 FL: you most choose the ones to play or pass based on your plan...understand your
targeting....this is a down wave in an uptrend

08:32 FL: the picking or passing has a lot to do with your goals..

08:32 FL: the most money will be made by taking all the waves. however in an uptrend the up waves will make good profits and the down waves will make a littl or break even that is ok...the opposite will occur in a down wave ...also in a choppy mkt both will make money but on a more equall bassis


14:30 FL: the power trades are nice

14:30 FL: a b c

09:07 FL: all I am showing is the window of opportunity that I use to start a play...this works very well for me, but you should use what ever works for you...trading is a very personal thing and should be designed with your goals and personality in mind....

11:38 FL: when it flips it will be..remember they all dont work ...need a plan with money management

11:46 FL: the traders mind....if you take the next one and it does not work you will assume they are not good, even though the last 11 of 13 power buys were good for 10 or more points...interesting..

11:51 FL: another interesting point for the TRADERS MIND ,since so many have worked it must be
time for it not to work.........dammed if you do and dammed if you dont......dont think just react.

11:52 FL: for me to get a power sale I would have to be in a downtrend...

11:53 FL: my trend still up....but I guarantee it will change to down.............when I dont know but I
guarante it will.

11:59 FL: and it is allways nice to see a power trade occur in a window of opportunity on the higher
time frame

12:09 FL: I do like the trades that occur early in the day though

12:10 FL: especially if you are in an uptrend and get a down opening and then a buy

12:19 FL: just to add more confusion to the fire a failed power buy has a good potencial for a nice
move in the other direction...

12:27 FL: only if it is part of your total plan

12:45 FL: example of what could have been done on this last trade....if you feel the mkt could be
toppy...buy 2 at 45.25 sell those out at 47.25, profit total 4 points (2 lots * 2 pts.).....now short 1 at 47.25 with a 4 point stop. if you get stoped out you hade a break even play.......if it starts down pyramid your position withbringing your stop down to worst case loss of 4 points , that will bring you down to break even on the entire play and if it does break you will make a nice profit...your call this is a bit advanced but can be part of your total plan....

12:47 FL: trading is a business...

16:48 FL: for positions you can use a lot of things and time frames ....for scalping one is enough

16:57 FL: I have a few simple setups for scalps..and more for positions with creative managament of
the trade,,,

16:59 FL: scalping is simple positions and thier management is like playing chess you must look a few moves ahead.

17:00 FL: its all about risk control

17:03 FL: you just saw it . in an uptrend you need a lower low than a lower high and when that turns
down = dot 1

17:04 FL: possible start of a down trend

17:04 FL: I now have an up and down trend in force I think this the fourth time since 1060 area.

17:05 FL: a dot 2 is a play within the trend

17:06 FL: but first you must decide on a gaplan or plans that fit you and your goals.

17:06 FL: game plan

17:07 FL: that is why I say set a goal, then work up a plan to achieve your goal....and have the needed money management in place to allow the plan time to work

17:08 FL: nothing is 100%

17:09 FL: so your trades should be based on your plan that is geared to acjive your goal..

17:10 FL: if you want 6 pts a week with 80%+ winners you must take trades with small targets etc etc.

17:11 FL: the plan must fit your goal.

12:30 FL: power trade = dot 2

14:57 FL: if the s&p closes down that would be a key reversal.......statisticaly that pattern does not
work well, even though it does work sometimes

12:34 FL: if a previous PT does not take out its previous high than the next one is not valid like 4

12:34 FL: now 3 is interesting that starts a downtrend doesnot end the uptrend

12:34 FL: 2 is a LL the next high was a LH so when the down wave starts that is a simple way to start a down trend with out ending the up trend . thus 2 trends at the same time

12:34 FL: I only use the day session charts . but I do trade after hours

10:58 FL: while I am up here I will be writing up a complete trading manual. last one I wrote was about 7 or 8 years ago. with complete plans for scalping and trading and option plays also will take a good few weeks.

10:58 FL: with money management

10:58 FL: and positioning etc.

10:58 FL: not sure but thinking in terms of a private room for those who want to follow it in a very serios manner .it can be customized to each trasers individual needs I allready started an outline...it will be for those who want to be trading in a true professional mannar.

10:58 FL: if it works out the way I am thinking, I will call the basic trades real time and those interested will have filled out a plan in advance and will just react to thier plans and goals

10:58 FL: my goal will be to find some people who can follw rules . I want to put out some more money under managament . and those that can do it I will give out money to trade on a percentage basis my way of starting more retierment...will see if it will work..

10:58 FL: I will themn follow there rules and if they prove they can I will fund more ...its a thought and a long shot ..if it works we all win ...wont start untill I get back to florida. but it will be for the very serious only who will do it my way .there is allways some discretion built in...would like to buikd a real trading company....we shall see

10:59 FL: for those that want to realy learn and feel they can qualify by temperment resourses and
time. it can be fun I will be helping them with the mental aspect during the day and the trading rules will be designed in advance...and there can be many variations of the game plans

11:00 FL: many variation for the rules possible but once they are set they must be followed .....

11:04 FL: I will work with each trader individualyb to help set up a game plan personalized for
them.....this will be limited to no more than a dozen or so participants.....that must be totaly commited to doing it right and making money.....

11:06 FL: and operating in a real business like manor. goals will be designed to fit the individual.

11:07 FL: if anyone has any thoughts or ideas you can email me at mbr4343@hotmail.com

11:09 FL: I give this a low probability of success but if it works the reward will far and away be great

11:16 FL: for example todays short, it was a downwave in an uptrend , also first signal of the day , also came after a blow out yesterday, and can be argued the last upwave was a fifth wave on elliot on a number of time frames....so do you play it or not and if so with what type of target ...plus some other stuff.....you should have a check sheet to see whay criteria each possible trade meets ..and your play or pass would have been predetermined......your goal is also a key....does this make sense........during the day no thinking just reacting to predefined rules ....is anybody getting the idea?????

11:19 FL: the only discreation comes with the targeting...the entry and stop are set.

11:21 FL: and if you play with targets you must adhear to never increasing your risk and managing it carefully.

11:25 FL: the first buy yesterday was not a power buy , but it was the first failure swing after a (hl) nice pull back in an uptrend ...many formation to watch....entry not difficult depending on what you are looking for.......

11:25 FL: enough for now all will be answered when I get the manual done......

11:29 FL: this could be interesting , but since I have proved my work over many years of high
profitability... if you want to participate it must be done my way but geared to your own goals and
risk...this is a good month or so away so enough for now

12:24 FL: no I am not charging I want to retire and develope a diversified group of traders that I can
trust and can show me they can follow rules and are willing to manage money my way so I can spend more time playing..

12:34 FL: I have been trading for over 40 years it is easy and simple , but very time consuming .. if I
can clone a few traders that do thier own trading and mine to ... no more work but still get the high
returns ...as I said this is a low probability of working but the risk to me is time and the rewards can be very nice..it is a reasonable gamble for me , we shall see

11:47 FL: if you play to many time frames you will get confused unless you treat them totaly seperate



12:08 FL: that is why you must have offers and bids in advance

12:09 FL: your action must PRECEED the mkt

12:10 FL: you should also have a stop in . I get burned from time to time also

12:10 FL: part of the game

12:11 FL: I scale shorts above the ma with a little judgement

12:17 FL: and hit a few stops I like buying into stops

12:17 FL: so I have a tight stop buy window for position on the daily

12:18 FL: this is position not a scalp

12:26 FL: positioning is like playing chess you must think many moves ahead...imo

12:28 FL: dont confuse scalping and positioning....pick your plays or game and master that before you move on to a seconed game..

12:28 FL: your plays must be seconed nature dont think just react

12:30 FL: and when I go for a position play I generaly get a few small losses before the play realy kicks in

12:31 FL: but when or if it does kick in I press it ...so my losses very small my wins very big as
compared to the losses....just good business.

12:33 FL: you must have a plan faith in it and expect it to be wrong from time to time

12:35 FL: without CONFIDENCE you will be lost in seconed guessing yoursel.

12:37 FL: all I was doing was buying against a tripple bottom

12:39 FL: I never know or even think I know what the mkt will do just play the probabilities

12:48 FL: as I said this is a low probability play dont follow my position trades unless you are prepared to take them all and manage them and pyramid them...you are guaranteed to lose with out a complete plan that you are willing to folow thru the good and bad

12:53 FL: 30 % winners with a 10 to 1 risk reward is a very powerful money maker..BUT with only 30% you can expect and will get strings of losers from time to time understand the math behind your plays.

12:55 FL: more importantly understand yourself and what type of mkt preasure you can deal with and define your plan to fit you

12:58 TraderM: FL: following up on dbq's earlier comment about setting an entry point half way
between vol stop and moving avg: is this a good rule of thumb? Seems your entry examples are closer the vol stop line, and you enter a bit sooner.

13:01 FL: I start my scale just above the ma and also have my finger on the sell button with a mkt order

13:04 FL: success is not or should not be measured on a single trade but over a series of
trades.....think about that

15:19 FL: I mentioned we were in a buy window of opportunity earlier ..i lost a little on first trade but
made up for it in spades on the seconed chance....you must have a plan and follow it ..this was position play on long side...

06:48 FL: choose anything you want for trend easy to start harder to end.just be consistent.and from time to time you can have a duel trend.before you get in know what your tgt will be

09:46 FL: hope you all have your plans set for today....yesterday a scalper might have had a little
trouble early in the day than a nice up move than a nice downmove scalper should have done well....the long positioner should have seen nice support in the 26 -27 area and with the run up should have been able to manage the position very well....for the short positioner when the mkt got to the 40-41 area some excelent resistance showed up and again with the break and proper trade management you should have a short on with at worst a breakeven stop above yesterdays highs...and the long positioner at worst should have a long with stops below yesterdays lows also worst case breakeven...

07:25 FL: it does not allways work but when you are in a buy window off opportunity on a higher time you can expect a nice pop when they work...when it took out the stops under 26 and went noware that was a nice clue....

07:25 FL: I think I wrote about it on my web page ...buying just before a trend change ...low risk
....trading stratagy....i think it is there

07:25 FL: once trade starts to work manage down to no or very low risk.....risk control...

07:25 FL: positioning is like scalping on a high time frame, but with trade management.

07:25 FL: trading is nothing more than defining a set of rules IN WRITING testing and believing in
them, than you can just react and not think during the day. now combine that with a TOTAL RISK

13:27 FL: I am not thinking in terms of an upfront fee. I am thinking in terms of a percentage of profits, and giving out money to manage...my thoughts at this point subject to change , is to set up a private room for those willing to trade totaly within my guide lines. however it will be tailored to each incividuals goals. I will call out all trade opportunities. everybody will have a complete and total trading plan and I will monitor the how close they can come to flawless execution of thier plan....a plan will be setup after a number of phone or personal meetings.....this are my thoughts now subject to change....but I will only work with those willing to follow a plan with no other outside nonesense.....

13:29 FL: they plans will be personalized to meet each traders goals ability and personalities.....some may like scalping others positioning and others some combination there of.
13:32 FL: when you folow a plan and learn to just react and not think it is easy...this is just the first

12:22 FL: part of the reason I sold out here is my stops are to far away ...i will rebuy higher or lower but when my stops are closer ...trade management

00:15 FL: when it boils I give it to them

07:49 FL: the prior upwave was a dot 1 did you recognize it

14:18 FL: the mkt will generaly try and do enough to piss off the most people.

14:21 FL: better to be pissed off than pissed on.

09:38 FL: when it boils I give it to them

22:36 FL: trading is mostly mental

22:38 FL: a higher high and a higher low

22:38 FL: in a down trend

22:39 FL: not a high percent winner but played right with pyramyding great risk reward

22:40 FL: yes get the trade on and manage your risk

22:41 FL: but you must have patience to wait for the trade and the guts to ride it in some form

22:42 FL: minamun risk $5,000

22:43 FL: you can have any goal you want but you must understand what it will take to achieve it

22:44 FL: trading 1 lot and paying yourself $2,000 a week is not reasonable

22:46 FL: 3 lots = 150 a pt 7 pts a week = 1,050 /....so you need to have amethodology that will achive 7 pts a week

22:46 FL: but it must be an absolute plan that you will follow

22:52 FL: if you will keep up swing charts by hand it will open up to you what is realy going on

22:53 FL: I am addamint about hand made swing charts...i cant trade without them

22:54 FL: it takes no time

22:55 FL: just like the chart I just posted

22:55 FL: just 4 simple lines today

22:55 FL: on 3 min

22:56 FL: I dont believe in pivots....they may work but not for me

22:57 FL: the only thing I believe in is the trend.....

23:02 FL: the backend is 2 fold I want a percent of profits you make and or manage money for me and I will pay you a fee

23:03 FL: I like having a position into reports 41 % go with the trend 46% a non event and 13% against you ....i like those odds when I have a cushion

12:23 FL: gm